Subject: RE: lists stuff
From: Joaquin Cuenca Abela (cuenca@celium.net)
Date: Thu Nov 30 2000 - 15:38:06 CST
Martin wrote:
>
> On Wed, 29 Nov 2000, Joaquin Cuenca Abela wrote:
>
[snip]
> > > > TRIANGLE_LIST Don't know what this should look like.
> > > > DIAMOND_LIST A8 ("Symbol" font)
> > > > STAR_LIST Don't know which of the stars to use.
> > > > IMPLIES_LIST Don't know what this should look like.
> > > > TICK_LIST Don't know what this should look like.
> > > > HAND_LIST If this is to be a hand with a finger pointing
> > > right, I've got
> > > > it at 0x46 in Wingdings.
> > > > HEART_LIST A9 ("Symbol" font)
> > > > </quote>
> > >
> > > Fair enough. Our approach makes a smaller dialog that is
> easier for power
> >
>
> We can easily put icons of all of these on the drop down menus.
even with that, the actual layout will have a problem. You will not see
inmediatelly the most used options.
I mean, when I opened the first time the word dialog, I would be capable to
figure *inmediately* all the lists that I could create. I quickly see the
list that I was searching, I clicked the list, "ok" button, and the list was
created.
With the word layout you can see at the same time all the "Styles" of lists
of a given type and all the "Types" of lists (even better, you don't need to
figure out what's a "Style" and what's a "Type" of list).
> > our dialog is not smaller. I've opened the unix shot of the
> dialog of some
> > days ago (the latest changes in the UI have not changed the size of the
> > dialog significatively) and I've taken a screenshot of the word
> dialog with
> > the gimp:
> >
> > word list dialog: 428x354
> > abi list dialog: 438x351
> >
> > the size is pretty much the same (the abi one is a bit bigger,
> specially if
> > we take in account that the unix shot that I've used was a
> dialog without
> > title).
> >
>
> I seem to remember it taking up the whole screen... With our one drawing
false impression :)
> area preview though we can better show the indentation of the list label
> and text area.
aha, but even here the word dialog has been correctly designed. Usually you
care of the indentation of the list label and text area when you want to
change the default values... and in word the dialog that let's you
"Customize" the list only has a preview (bigger than the previews that you
see in the first list's dialog).
We can say that our dialog has been designed (more or less) like the
"Customize" list's dialog of word. And we can say (IMHO) that it makes
sense to design a simplistic dialog for the lists because the 90% a user
only needs the simple dialog (of course, adding a button to show the "hard"
dialog, just like word).
[snip]
> > Sam opened abiword and said me:
> >
> > "Look, it seems that I've found a way to reproduce that bug. Open the
> > dialog, select a type for your list, click in AbiWord so the
> dialog lost the
> > focus, and... voila! the type selected in the dialog disappeares"
> >
> > Both, Sam and me, were thinking that actually that was a bug.
> Only after I
> > realized that it was a supposed feature (heavilly related with
> the modeless
> > character of the dialog). I know for sure that, to me, the
> dialog look&feel
> > seemed very confusing.
> >
> > (disclaimer: that's an approximate quote, Sam, please, if you don't said
> > that, or you didn't think that it was a bug, just nuke me in public)
> >
>
> Yes that was a terrible mis-feature and one reason I debugged the List
> dialog for 0.7.12. Mike, Thomas and I are working hard to get that right.
> I think we will succeed. You will not lose your selected lists accidently
> with the new design.
ok, so if all the problems that I've enumerated can be solved retaining the
modeless character of the dialog, it's ok for me the leave the dialog
modeless.
> > > A smaller dialog is more
> > > appropriate for a Modeless dialog.
> >
> > but 1) the dialog is not smaller and 2) I don't think (by the
> reasons that
> > I've stated) that it has to be modeless.
> >
>
> Clearly it doesn't have to be modeless but I think we can make a modeless
> dialog without the bugs you've described. I think it will be a new and
> cool thing that would not be hard to implement on our current code base.
Ok, I don't know how it can be done, but I trust you (after all, nobody here
knows the modeless framework and the list's dialog like you :)
So, again, anybody thinks (yet :) that our list's dialog UI is better than
the word one (besides the modeless stuff)?
Anybody will be again a change of the list's dialog to mimic the word one?
Cheers,
-- Joaquin Cuenca Abela cuenca@celium.net
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