Re: Fwd: Smart quotes patch

On Feb 7, 2008 4:45 AM, Tomas Frydrych <tf@o-hand.com> wrote:
> Nope, undo immediately after smart-quote replacement should revert back
> to the plain quote. Only a second undo should remove the actual insertion.

This makes no sense to me, since if you don't want smart quotes, just
disable them.

However, I tried it in Word, and it works as you said, so QED, you win.

> Add strings for the four or so quote types to the XAPString tables as I
> suggested. This allows you to fine grain it as needed (e.g., can have
> different quotes for de-DE and de-CH).

Yes however, I have been using this as my guide:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quotation_mark,_non-English_usage

Wherein it states:
- Sometimes, especially in books, the angle quotation marks (see
below) are used in Germany and Austria, albeit in reversed order: »O«.

This may be wrong. Can a German confirm or deny it?

Assuming it is true, one locale can have more than one quoting system.

>
> > 2) How to switch languages period. If I type an English article with
> > a German quote, what do you do?
>
> You switch language to German *before* starting the quote.
>
> > Someone suggested checking the
> > language of the previous character, but that doesn't work for the same
> > reason it looks like smart quotes were always broken - paragraphs
> > often start with quotes, which means you have no previous character.
>
> You do not check the language of the previous character, but the
> language at the insertion point.
>
> > I think the best solution would be a tool bar or dialog option that
> > allows you to set the quote marks to whatever funky combination your
> > language/locale uses.
>
> Nope, this should just work without the user having to mess about with
> anything.

I had never used the "Set Language" option before. I have now
explored it a little, and this approach has some major problems:
1) See above about multiple quotation styles for one locale.
2) There is a "no proofing" option. A German might use this to turn
off spell checking, but might still want German smart quotes.
3) It does not save my preference between documents. I assume it just
reverts to the machine's locale, in which case, that's probably OK.
4) As I said, I had never heard of the option before, because I never
had a need for it. If I wish to type in Hebrew, which I sometimes do,
I change the keymap for my desktop and change Abiword to default the
document to RTL if I wish.
5) Is having to change the language not "having to mess about with anything."

This seems like it's basically a spelling/grammar checking option
which is being repurposed for a function it doesn't match.

>
> > I'd also like to add the option to translate bactick "`" to open quote
> > and apostrophe "'" to close quote. In English, it is impossible for
> > the word processor to figure out whether an apostrophe at the
> > beginning of a word is the start of a quote or an abbreviation used in
> > speech ('em for them).
>
> I am not too sure about adding an option for this; it strikes me as a
> marginal case and it is easy to work around.

I disagree completely that this is a marginal case.

Harry Potter books are the best selling books of all time (with the
exception of the Bible). Read anything said by Hagrid, it is littered
with these. Other authors start words with apostrophes in dialog all
the time. Not to mention, one of the most famous English poems,
"'Twas the night before Christmas."

Though, you did mention a work-around, what did you mean?

My proposal is to have a smart quotes tab in the options dialog (as in
the patch I submitted). To this I would add a combobox with a list of
predefined list of smart quote styles and a separate table tying each
style to a locale. One of the entries would be "Custom" which would
enable you to set the quote characters manually. Abiword would store
the quote settings for each of the 4 quote chars. If no setting
exists, it would default to the current locale's default.

A user need not make any changes if they want it to "just work" for
the default of their locale. If they change it, it is stored across
sessions. If you need to switch quotes in the middle of a document,
you go to the dialog and change it.

All this being said, I personally only need smart quotes for English.
If I need to tie it to the language to get it accepted, so be it.

BTW, who makes decisions about what is in or out of Abiword?

Bobby
Received on Fri Feb 8 03:51:14 2008